Anthony Nava: Reframing Your Professional Future

Hey everyone, welcome back to Make It Happen Mondays, where we talk about sales, business, entrepreneurship, personal growth, mental health, and everything in between with guests who I truly respect and I think make a positive impact on the world around us. Today's conversation is with Anthony Nava. He's a senior sales development manager at Crunchbase. Anthony has taken a really interesting path to his success and to how he's gotten to where he is today. And I think a lot of this conversation will resonate with a lot of you who might be going through the same thing right now. He majored in molecular biology in college because he thought he might like it and his parents definitely improved. But like many of us who are forced to decide what they want to be for the rest of their lives at the ripe old age of 18 years old, he realized he didn't want to spend the rest of his life in a pharmacy or staring down a microscope.

That's when he found sales. He went from selling at Target to selling ambulances to eventually finding his way into the tech world and catching his stride at greenhouse technology. Now, unfortunately, COVID hit and he was laid off like so many others. But instead of jumping right back into the labor market and taking a job just because he had to, Anthony decided to take a step back and reevaluate what was really important to him. And from there, he found a job at Crunchbase and continues to thrive. Throughout this conversation, Anthony shares his thought process at the different inflection points that he's had in his life that I think will really help a lot of people who, like I said, might be going through the same issues and challenges that he faced right now.

I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. Let's make it happen. What's happening, make it happen, family? Big shout out to our partners today, Gong, Vidyard, and Chili Piper. Gong's data is more than valuable. It's cornerstone in any organization looking to collect the data that's going to tell them where they can improve and where they need to spend their time making changes. Vidyard makes it easy for people to use videos anywhere. No matter whether you're sending videos in email or on social media, posting them somewhere or sending them in a DM, Vidyard has got you covered. Our friends at Chili Piper are so much fun to be around. They make it easy for people to get on your calendar.

And every sales rep has got to have this function locked in. It's one of the most important things we can do as a seller. How can I get you on my calendar easily? Chili Piper can make that happen for you. Be sure that you're checking out all these great tools. And now let's pass it over to John to find out who's joining him today. See you soon, everybody. Anthony, Nava, what's going on, brother? How are you doing? I'm doing great. John, it's actually been crazy, man. Last time I talked to you, 2020, you were helping us with our SKO, setting us up for agile selling a year and 50 million series D later, we're here, man. So first off, full circle. Secondly, DJ'd a van on Saturday. And a lot of Bruin fans came in after they whooped the Sharks.

So as much as I hated that, I hated that. They were the funnest crowd I've ever DJ'd for. So hats off to y'all for being a great fan. There you go. Yeah. Boston travels well, man. Boston travels well. We're pretty obnoxious, but we're also pretty goddamn fun too. Deep. Yeah. So I appreciate that, man. And I can't stand it also when they play on the West Coast because they start the games at 1030 and it kills me. I ain't staying up until two o'clock in the morning watching hockey. Sorry. But right now, I got the Bs and the Celtics right now. It's top of the league in both ends. And my Patriots are obviously struggling, but I'll take the Celtics all day long. Hey, man. As long as there's an opportunity, man.

Boston's a winning city too. That's one place that it's not bad to be a sports fan there. No, we've been gluttonous for the past 20 years, man. And I'm loving every minute of it. But let's get into it, Anthony. I mean, one of the things that was kind of the impetus for this call is the economy that we're going into. A lot of people getting laid off and kind of your story about how what happened to you and you getting laid off kind of come COVID time and how you reframed your thought process and where you are today. So, you know, the goal of today is really to give people some insights into kind of how they should be looking at their career, what they should be looking at right now, you know, if they're at a company, but a little afraid they're going to get laid off or if they're looking for a job right now.

So why don't you, Anthony, give us a little bit of your background here. Talk to us how we got here and then we'll talk us where we're going, all right? Yeah, I'd love to. So I've been selling for 10 years since I was in college. I was working at Wells Fargo Bank as a teller, became a banker, Target, selling on the sales floor. I even sold ambulances. And then it wasn't until I broke into tech that I realized how awesome it is to be in this type of culture and a passion for it because I actually graduated with a master's in molecular biology. And originally I wanted to be a pharmacist. And at some point that you realize that what you, what you're good at and what you enjoy is what's really going to dictate how you're going to have a quality of life.

So during that crossroad, I found out sales is what I wanted to do. Broke into the scene, worked for a company called Aspire IQ that started selling social media and influence a marketing platform. Moved to Denver, grew a team out there. I was lucky enough to, you know, double the team there and live out in Denver. And then during Denver, that's when I started working at a company called Greenhouse. And at that time, Greenhouse poached me. They were telling me that they're going to fly me out to New York, do a training. Amazing company, amazing culture. I thought when I got hired there, this is it. I'm set. I found the company that I want to do. COVID came in and just smacked me right in the face and said, nope, that's not going to happen.

And from my two months at Greenhouse, you know, during COVID, that's when I was laid off. And it's the first time I'd been laid off. I mean, I know a lot of people had during that time, but when it happened, it was really that time where I was saying, you know what? As much as I had this goal and plan set in mind for me, I know that this is leading into a direction that's going to be something deeper and more meaningful down the road. So when that happened, you know, first off, shout out to the entire staff over at Greenhouse. They were so supportive. They had a Slack channel. They were reaching out to people, letting them know about the job openings and personal recommendations for people and adding each other on LinkedIn to just share like, hey, this is someone I know that's hiring, I think you'd be a great fit.

But from that time, I did a couple of things. You know, one is I really wanted to evaluate what is it that I want to be focusing on for this next year? What is it that I want in my next company that's going to make me feel the same feeling I had when I initially joined Greenhouse? And then secondly, outside the professional career, what is it that's also going to make me happy besides a successful professional career? And that's when I really honed in on DJing, started doing that during the pandemic because clubs were closed down. So I had to entertain the audience and the masses somehow. And within that time, during those six months, you know, finding the right company, talking to the right people, figuring out what it is that's going to make me happy in the next step.

I was very fortunate enough to land a few job offers when it came down to it. I think for me, what I considered the most important thing, like the top three things that led me to determine like this is going to be a good company for me was number one, what's the product? Is it something that, you know, you believe, you believe in, it's going to make an impact, it is going to change the game? I think secondly, what's the culture like? How are they viewing employees first? What's their mission statement? What's the values that they have? Quick research on that goes a long way. And lastly, the biggest thing for me is what's leadership like? Are they transparent? Are they talking positively about their team, their product, their culture?

Are they really driving home what their company is about and a lot of what they're talking about? And those were the key things that I was looking for. And as you interview with people, you find that out a lot. Like I think a lot of people don't realize that it's not just them interviewing you to see if you're a fit for that role. It's you interviewing them to make sure that this is the right company and even the right manager for you. And I really got that with Crunchbase. I spoke to everyone and it just felt very natural talking to everyone there. I knew that if I got in there, that they're really supportive, especially during the time of being laid off and off the pandemic. And of course, I knew that being someone that's used the tool before, I knew how valuable it was.

So it was pretty easy for me to make that decision. But fast forward now, I've been here for over two and a half years, became a senior manager, helped almost triple the team. And all of that happened because I really took my time. I was unemployed for six months. And at the time, it is scary, right? You don't know when's the next time you're going to eat and especially adding in COVID and everything. But at the same time too, you got to trust that process. Like jumping into something that you're not happy for is going to cause an impact. Yeah, I'll ask you, how old are you right now? I'm 33. Fucking young kid. But so you were around 30 when you kind of had this take a step back, let me like a little shock there, right?

Right. There's two inflection points that I want to talk to you about. One is the inflection point of you realizing that molecular biology was not your thing and that you wanted to get into sales. And then the other is when you took that step back after you got let go and started to reevaluate what was really important to you. So I want to start with the one earlier though, because I think this is something that so many people and I am inherently frustrated with. I wrote a blog post a long time ago called Stop Doing What You're Supposed to Do, right? Because a lot of us go through the motions and we don't know any better when we're kids. You know what I mean? Like you're supposed to go to college.

You're supposed to get a job. You're supposed to get married. You're supposed to have kids. You're supposed to buy a house, right? But I've always found it kind of insane that we ask kids at 18 years old what they want to be for the rest of their life when they've never even, when we don't even know what life is. And so walk me through like why, first of all, molecular biology, right? Because you want to be a pharmacist. Like what was that driver? And was that like, oh, I want to be or I guess this is what I want to be. And then when was it in college or was it after college was the realization that this just ain't it. Like this is, this doesn't like, I thought this was it, but this ain't it.

And then what brought you to sales? So walk me through that, that first, I want to be a molecular, you know, that to, I don't know to sales. Let's talk about that first. Yeah. So being a Filipino, Mexican American, I was told the only way you're successful is if you have a good job. And to some extent that is, that is true. But a good job at the time was a doctor, a nurse, an accountant, like that was, that was considered what was successful. So got in there again at 17 when they're like in high school, Hey, what school do you want to apply to? And what major do you want to be in? I had no idea, came in undeclared. I thought engineering was good because of course, mom's like, Hey, you got to make that money.

I'm looking for, you know, a new car, you know, when you finish. So find a good job, did that absolutely could not do math or physics for the life of me. And I said, well, you know what? I think I have some strong suits within that. So a lot of people usually have, you know, science courses taken into that. So decided to do science, did some research, met some friends. And a lot of people were trying to be doctors and a few of them were being pharmacists. And I said, you know what? I think being a pharmacist is something that I, I think I could do after, you know, working at a time. That's important by the way, for people listening, there's a, I want to do this because I am passionate about it versus I think I could do this.

Like, and that's, and if, for those of you listening right now, if you're in college or if you're out there and you're like, I think I could do this, think again, think again, we're going to get back to anything, what you used to now that the other inflection point, but keep going on that one. Cause I think that's an, that's such an important thing that most kids are like, all right. You know, I could, I did the same thing with you. I went from like, my first major was art. Cause I was like, I'm, I was the best artist in my little town of, you know, 12,000 people in my graduating class of, you know, 120 kids. And then I got into university of Maryland and I sat down next to like actual artists and I had a heart attack.

I was like, holy shit. I ain't that good. And I was like, well, engineering, my dad's an engineer. I'm good at math. So let me try that. Got smoked with calculus. And I was like, oh, bio biology. I'm, I like science. And then failed out immediate, like failed up my bio class, like literally first test. And I ended up in marketing because it was like, okay, I guess like, this is kind of easy to do. I can get into the class, whatever. So, so we kind of evolved to it. Right. But, but you then kind of said, all right, well, I think I can do this now. Now, where'd you go from there? So I did it. I took courses. I graduated with it. And as I mentioned before, I've been doing sales the whole time. College doesn't pay for itself.

At 17, I was financially independent. My parents said, find a way you'll make it happen. And we did shout out to them for pushing me to do that. So I was working. And at the time I was a sales floor team leader at Target. I just opened up the first Target Express in San Francisco and that Target Express had a pharmaceutical department. So just fresh out of college, still trying to find a job in molecular biology because I'm still applying for pharmacy school. Talked to the pharmacist there and said, Hey, this is something I want to do. I'd love to shadow you. And after shadowing them and hats off to any pharmacist, I, for the life of me, could not do that for the rest of my life. Like it was just, it didn't seem, it just wasn't as engaging as I'd like it to be.

You're, you're pretty much by yourself most of the time, or just, you know, working with detectively prescriptions. And I knew that plus I had an internship doing cancer research and I was behind a microscope for, you know, 40 hours a week by myself. Like that, that drives a person crazy. So at that point, you know, I, I hadn't hit me yet, but I knew that I didn't want to be a pharmacist. And I said, well, I already graduated with a degree. I do want to make the most use of it. So let me figure out like, again, like this, let me figure this out. Let's see what we can do here. So I applied for a master's program for molecular biology because I'd spoken to my previous professor and they were telling me that, Hey, you could be a director.

Usually they require a master's. So here's a program to look into. And again, college is expensive. They, they, they do not make that cheaper as time goes on. You know, that is something that's always going to go up. So I knew that even my, my jobs at the time, even it was a full-time 40 hours, it just wasn't enough. So I talked to a colleague over at Wells Fargo. He broke into tech. I asked him how that experience was, led me to a recruiter, got me into my first company. And once I started working in tech, like, first off, I love the product. I love the team. And I was like, wait a minute. I'm making more than an entry-level person that I would have gotten my master's, you know, being a sales development representative.

What? Let me ask you real quick. When you said you, you love the product, was that a conscious thing? When you, when you heard about tech and your boy from Wells Fargo was like, yo, you might want to check this out. How did, because I want to compare that to how you chose where you are today with Crunch Base, right? So were you consciously looking at companies that you could, you know, that you like their product and that type of thing? Or were you just looking for jobs? So at that time, because the recruiter gave me, you know, a lot of companies to look into, it was really choosing the company that I felt like I resonated with. And at that time, my DJ career just got started. Social media was, was really a big thing, especially trying to get your brand name out there.

So the company that I was looking at was actually an influencer marketing platform. And that's when I was like, easy connecting the dots here. DJ that loves being on social media, company that does it, that focuses on influencer marketing. It's a no brainer. But here's actually a good thing that you're mentioning about that. When it came down to deciding, there was a lot of companies that gave me an offer. And at that point, I even had to ask myself, some of these companies are offering me 25k more to sell a data analytics platform. And at the time, I had to ask myself, is this something I want to do for a really handsome reward and a paycheck? Or is this something where I really will enjoy learning about this product, selling it and really be behind it?

And, you know, talking to a few people, a lot of people were like, hey, man, take, take the money. You're, you're in a master's program. This is potentially life-changing for you being, you know, a college graduate making, you know, 80 to 90k, like do it. And, and something would seem, I'm like, but am I going to be happy selling data and analytics? No knock on people that do that, but that's not what I'm, you know, my fortes in and what I enjoy. So I took that, you know, the risk, I guess you can call it when with that company, but, you know, looking at it in hindsight, if they took care of me, I was able to come in there, do the work, be passionate about not only the product, but the people of that company.

I became an entry-level inbound SDR and became a SDR manager in nine months working for that company where I initially took that lower, that lower pay. What was different, that's a fast rise to management in SDRs, especially in today's world right now. What were you doing different than all the other reps? Because, and the reason I ask this is because I think a lot of, the reason I love sales is because it is truly one of the only professions where the harder you work, the more you get paid, right? And, and the faster you go, at least theoretically. But there's a lot of reps that just go through the motions, right? They get their commission. You know, they, they kind of do the bare minimum. They show up and they, you know, they treat it as a job because maybe they don't believe in what it is.

So what were you doing different in those nine months compared to the other inbound SDRs that were hired around the same time as you, that got you to, to rise as fast as you did? Yeah. I think going back to our initial conversation of like, what's a big focus for me this year? And that's just being intentional. I think that's, that's something that I really carried into myself coming into that role and really being in that company. Because for me, I was a little bit older. A lot of the people that were hired there, like, you know, I, I took some time graduating. I had a lot of fun in college. I was DJing most of the time. It was normally a four-year plan. Some people would have probably got a doctor's degree at that time, but I did it.

And that's all that matters. So I was a little bit older than people, you know, my mindset was a little bit different. And I think coming into that, again, the beauty of sales is that I knew I had goals for myself at that time. I was like, I want to be financially successful and be able to do these things. I want to be able to be, you know, very, make my parents very proud about the role that I'm doing. So anytime I came into work, it wasn't just, oh, hey, got to do these calls, get this money and bounce. It's like, I got, I got to be successful. I got, I got to be the best person I could be. And I think with that, along with having a lot of empathy and passion for people, I was the orientation leader in college.

So I've always enjoyed seeing people become successful, naturally helping out team being collaborative. That just was a strong suit of mine that my manager saw. And you couple that with the drive to just want to be successful and the best rep out there. That's the stuff that really pays in dividends. When you come in out the gates, ready to prove a point coming in from, I was a target, you know, sales for a leader. Now coming into tech, entry-level brand new, got a little chip on my shoulder. You accomplished a lot. And I think that mixed with, you know, a little dash of timing, it made it perfect, you know, for me to have that happen because I don't want it to make it seem like, hey, this happens all the time.

But if you just, if you eliminate that factor and just put in the hard work and have the passion for it, when that time comes, my saying always is, you don't have to get ready if you stay ready. And that was, that's how it kind of happened for me, at least in those nine months. Um, we're going to ask. All right. So you rose up, you get another job, you get COVID hits. You have six months of what the fuck, right? Like I just got laid off, never been laid off before in my life. Um, did you immediately go into job hunting or did you take a step back? And actually, oh, I'm sorry. This is, let me ask, let me, I'm going to pause on that question. Cause I forgot to ask this one. Were your parents immigrants?

So they were not actually, they were, they were actually first born, but did not go to college. Okay. Yeah. Cause I'm curious, do you think a little, you talk a little bit about that chip on your shoulder. Does that come from the immigrant background or do you think that is, that is something inherent in you as a person in general? Cause I always try to figure out where drive comes from. And I'm curious where you think your drive, your passion comes from. I'd say it's a mixture of both. And, and let me, let me explain that first part. Right. So granted, my parents weren't immigrants. I mean, they, they came here, they were born here. Um, you know, live the life here, didn't go to college though.

And got careers there, but talking about impacts, my mom was actually laid off from her company. I want to say back in, like, I think during the housing market crash in like 2007. And what I watched with that, with a mixture of resilience, but also a little bit of struggle too, was she started a food truck. And at that time, you know, that's a very scary thing to do, you know, like start a business, a risky business too, because at the time food trucks weren't, that wasn't a solidified thing yet that we all know and love. Now that was, that was, yeah, now it's hot, you know, now back then it wasn't though. So that's, that's something that I witnessed. I helped her every day. I watched her prep.

She worked these long hours. She came from a nine to five where she was making a very consistent money. You know, I was a very, I was a very blessed child. She gave me everything that I needed, that I wanted without hesitation to ask. And going from that to a food truck, when things got tight, you really feel that. And granted that I was like maybe 19 years old, that I, I felt that probably even more and, and watching her have to do that. You know, I, I was like, you know, motivated by the fact that she really made something happen from that. And, and from that point, I'm like, I can't, I can't fail her. Like she hasn't done that for me yet. I got to keep this going and make myself just as hardworking, successful as she was.

So I think that's definitely the, the big piece about it. She may have not been an immigrant, but she was struggling at that time and found a way to make that happen. And then intrinsically, I think that's what keeps me going as, as a person. Like I, I've learned from, you know, people around me, especially my own mother, that you can't sit here and expect the world to feel sorry for you when stuff gets bad. You, you got to go out there. You got to, you got to find a way to get yourself fed and you just got to make it out. And I carry that with me literally every day. And, and I think that's a huge reason where I'm at where I'm at, especially during a lot of these, these trying times. I love that, man.

Yeah. Cause I've, I've always tried to explore like the nature nurture factor, right. Of where, where people get their drive, because, you know, for me, I was extremely fortunate, you know, white male born to two loving parents who stayed together for 55 years with a sister who was nine years older than me. I mean, basically white picket fence type of shit. I mean, we weren't rich, but we were, we were, you know, middle-class, right. My mom and dad worked hard. So I had a good role models for, for work ethic. Um, so for me, I don't know if it was, I think it's obviously a little bit of both regardless it's nature and nurture, but it's always interesting to me because sometimes you come across people who like their parents are just dogs, you know what I mean?

Like they don't, they don't even get out of bed in the morning, but they're the most driven person. So it's almost the opposite effect. It's like, they see how unmotivated their family was. And so they're saying, I'm getting it right. Whereas other people's have people who motivate them and inspire them like they're, you know, just by leading by example. So I'm, I'm just curious. I appreciate you, you give me that insights. So now let's jump to, let's jump to this, this inflection, this other inflection point for you, where you get laid off. You got about six months and let's, let's go back to who was, it was an immediate panic. Cause I remember I got fired once in my, I got actually shit. I'll take that back.

I got, I've been fired twice in my life. Um, and, and the, the, the second time it was, it was literally like, Oh, what? Like, and it was all of us, like CEO walked in and said, get the fuck out, like leave. Like we're, we're shutting down the doors like today type of thing. And what happened was everybody else went into survival mode, right? Everybody else was like, Oh my God, I got to get a job. I got to get healthcare. I can't, you know, blah, blah, blah. And I, for whatever reason had a different lens on it as an opportunity because I was like, Ooh, this guy just walked away from what was a, you know, $3 million business. Like there's, there's money to be made there. So I ended up negotiating a deal with him and taking over the company that he had basically left on the side of the road to die.

So there was, you know, I've always said that my, there's a lens that I have, if there is anything I've been blessed with, it's, I have an opportunistic lens and I, and I'll, I'll look at something and without too many data points or without too much analysis, I'll usually be able to make a pretty good decision and go. And I don't overanalyze it. So from your perspective, when you got fired, A, were you expecting it? B, what was your immediate reaction to it? And then C, what took six months? So it's, it's for anyone that's gone through this, I can definitely relate because at that time, you know, it was already going around that, like a lot of major companies are doing major layoffs. It's a pandemic, like it's no surprise that something's not right here.

And unfortunately people are going to be impacted by it. And I just remember sitting on Slack, you know, they, they had announced that they called us in this morning, had a whole team meeting and said, Hey, you know, we're, we're going to be, you know, unfortunately doing layoffs. They gave us a chart of how many people are going to be doing it. And sales team was a huge chunk as you know, unfortunately it always is. And, you know, I'm excited to talk a little bit more about how people can be successful despite that, that, that statistic. But with that, I knew it, I was like, with that number glaring in my face, there's a very slim chance that I'm going to be here, but there's hope, right? There's hope.

And slowly you just see the slacks deactivate happen. And then calendar invite gets added and you cross your fingers and hope that it's good news. And then they start with the, unfortunately, and that's when, you know, this is where it's going. So initially when it happened, I was speechless. I had never been, I've been fired before. I've never been let go in terms of a layoff. So I didn't know how to respond. I sat there. I think the first thing I did was just text my peers and colleagues and just say, you know, Hey, how are you all doing? How's your mental space? Like what's going on? Maybe we should, you know, find a way to just connect with each other and chat. And just initially, like from that time, something, something just clicked in me that said like, this sucks.

And I know it sucks, but at the same time too, all is not lost. And at some point, this is going to be the redirection into something greater. You don't know what it is yet, but it will be. So why don't you just sit back, figure out what you're going to do. Don't jump into anything right away and just let life take its course. And, you know, during that six months, right? I think the first thing I initially said was like, what, what makes me happy pointed to the turntables on like this, this does. So let me, let me spend some time just building social media, making mixes. Like, let me just use my creative outlet to, to be my person and figure things out. So first thing I did, got on, started doing live streaming, started, you know, recording a lot of stuff, you know, my other side of the business, which is my, my DJing career.

And that actually proved to be a huge motivator. I, I grew a huge following from that because everyone's on their phone and everyone's not going to the club. And that for me was really motivating because I was like, okay, people, people are liking the mixes and loving the DJing stuff. They're loving what I love to do. I think, I think it's time now to, to kind of take a step into the professional and figure things out. So that's when, you know, I, I talked to a few people, um, spoke to different, you know, companies and like I talked about earlier, just did some research to make sure that, that I figured out whichever is going to be the best company for me is the one that I'm really going to dedicate my time to.

Why didn't you lean in on the DJ thing? Like that would, that seemed like it was your passion. You were happy, you know, it made you happy. Like you said, um, why was there a point where you looked at it and said, how can I make a living doing this? Um, like from a business standpoint, or did you always look at DJing as your outlet, not necessarily your profession? I think for me personally, it's definitely was more of the outlet for me and all the monetary benefits from it just capped in just really naturally. I think another thing too, about the pandemic, because first and foremost, I'm always about people following their dreams, doing what they need to do to make it happen. And, you know, what you can call the starving artists.

Like I, I really, really commend people for doing that. Another thing I noticed when I saw the pandemic is that it's unforgiving for everybody. And to see a lot of DJs that I knew struggle, go through, you know, having to find a career that they didn't really have any insurance on. That's all they knew. And I think for me, I knew DJing was something that I can do at the same time as my passion. I've always been 40 hours doesn't exist. It's you work until, you know, your body says no. So I always felt like that was able to do the balance of both. So for me, I'm always trying to figure out how can I continue to have multiple streams of income? And rather than letting go of my day job and focusing solely on DJing, I know I can do both.

I know I can do entirely both. And just at the time of the pandemic, my first thought was that DJing right now is my creative outlet. It's helping me just be sane during these really weird times. And that's how I really viewed it and focused on it then. What's up, everybody? I know you're enjoying this conversation. John does a great job with genuine curiosity on these episodes and our guests consistently bring the heat. We want to take a moment here and let you know that you've got an opportunity, an opportunity to become better than you were yesterday. And you can do so by gaining access to all of JB Sales content, all of their training tips, techniques, tactics, and takeaways can be yours for $1 a day.

$365 for the year gets you annual access to everything, including our private Slack channel for members only, which you get access to all of us directly 100% of the time, 24 hours a day. And then at the same time, you're going to get access to our bi-weekly Ask Me Anything sessions where you can bring real deals to the table and get the help that you need. where you need it. This is very, very important. Sales reps that invest in themselves are often found at the tops of their leaderboards. Join us today and get the help you need to become the seller that you deserve to be. That URL one more time is joinjbsales.com. Let's get back to the show with JB and our guest for this week. Probably some of the worst advice that I've heard my generation and above, you know, give to your generation and below is follow your passion, okay?

Especially at such a young age, right? Because if you're 18, like, again, you just don't know what you're really passionate about. Like for me, if somebody, if I had followed my passion when I was 18, I'd be a stoner artist living on the streets for crying out loud. You know what I mean? Like, that's what, but the point is find your passion, then follow it. And I don't think you really find your passion, like what you're truly genuinely passionate about until you try a bunch of shit. You know what I mean? Like you, you experiment a lot in your twenties and you figure out what, like this, I don't like that, whatever. And then, Ooh, there it is. And then it sounds like when, you know, you, you hit the same groove where when you, in your thirties, you kind of pick a lane, you know what I mean?

You're like, all right, I'm now going to go all in on this. Cause I I'm good at it. And then when you hit my bracket of forties, now you've kind of, now it's about wealth creation, right? Cause now you've put in your 10,000 hours. Now you can really just put the, you know, just put the pedal down. And so your criteria, right? For looking at companies and now that, that got you landed at Crunchbase of what's the products, the company values, and then leadership, how do you coach or talk to other people about that lens who are panicking right now and saying, Anthony, look, I, you know, all well and good man about me, you know, finding a job I love and I'm passionate about, but dude, I I've been, I haven't been, I've been out of work for two fucking months right now, man.

If I don't get a paycheck, how do you help them figure out or what advice do you give them to, to, to kind of play that short-term, long-term gain there? You know what I mean? Where it's like, you know, long-term you want something happy that's going to fulfill you and be something you can make income in, but you need money right now and you need a job and you brought up a great point as far as interviewing, right? I mean, people who need a job to, to pay the bills, they get interviewed. People who are looking for happiness and fulfillment are interviewing. So, so how, what advice do you give to those people out there who are thinking about it saying, yeah, it sounds great, John. You and you and Anthony always talk about, you know, find your passion and, you know, do what you love and all that.

But fuck you, man. I got mortgage to pay. I got bills and I am screwed. I need a goddamn job. Like, how do you help them balance that? Or what advice would you give them? Yeah. So the first piece on that of assessing it, right? Everyone has different financial situations. And I recognize that completely. And I think the first piece of advice I'd love to ask people too, because the first thing I ask people is like, what's your, what do you like to do? What's your passion? What do you enjoy? And my follow-up is like, can that make you money? Can you turn that to some monetary thing? And a lot of people normally don't think about that. For example, at the time, um, I was dating someone that was fantastic with Excel, great at creating sheets and had a very like design aesthetic to it.

And she wasn't working. The restaurant business, you know, was at the time going through some, some weird, you know, notions and people were either just, you know, furloughed or not working. She started an Etsy shop of creating planners. And I had no idea at the time you could make money off of that until she said, I'm going to go create an Etsy shop and create planners for people. And I'm, I'm just going to go in and sell it. And like, she took what she's good at, put it into something, you know, a few things had to be thrown on the wall before it stuck. But, you know, she kind of made that happen and, you know, started being like, you know, 20, $30 a month to like, I think at one point, a thousand dollars.

So the lesson there is that while you are trying to find this right company you're looking for, ask yourself, what can I do in the meantime to kind of couple the things that I enjoy doing, but also kind of keep that, that hustler, you know, kind of grit mentality of like, clothes knots don't get fed. So I got to make sure that I'm doing something to kind of stay afloat. So that's, that's one piece of advice I can offer people to think about. A lot of people always think like, I don't have talents. There's nothing that I get at spend some time really thinking about it and trying things. You will never know what will take care of you, especially with social media nowadays. You can literally eat food in front of people and you'll make money off of it.

So, right. I think that's the one thing that I, that I is, this, this is why I'm, I'm a little sour on, on college more than I ever have been. Because again, my generation, college was the ticket. Like you needed a college degree to really get a job that would pay you anything remotely close to something that you could use to pay back that college loans and make a living. Right now, that ain't the price of admission anymore. There's a million ways to make money. And I think so many people have limiting mindsets of, and including myself, by the way, of, of what they can or could do. And there's, I mean, shit, if you really wanted to right now, you could sign up for Alibaba and Amazon and make a mint.

Like, you know, Alibaba usually sells their shit for about a fifth is what Amazon sells it for. So you buy it, you drop it, drop ship that shit to Amazon and you set up your little Amazon store and you make money without even trying. Like it's just about the application. Why do you think, why do you think people are stuck in, are still stuck in like an older mentality? Because I talked to some people I know right now, like we're looking for jobs and I'm like, have you like looked at like doing an Amazon shop, like an eBay thing? Like, well, no, yeah, I know you can make money. Well, how do you do it? I'm like, fucking Google it. Like, why do you think that people are, have the limiting mindset right now with the fact that there are so many options out there?

I think there's a couple of things. The first one that comes to mind is a little bit about the personality slash the person, right? I think people are scared. They're scared to not be successful. They're scared to look stupid. They're scared to just be judged on something. Or maybe if it doesn't work out, they're scared to be seen as a failure. I think that's one thing that a lot of people do. They don't like putting themselves out there. And yeah, we know it's a scary thing. But at the same time too, at this point with like, what's going on? What do you really have to lose at this point? You know, like it's probably some of the weirdest times that some people will ever experience in their lives.

There's so much to gain. And I think that switch of mindset will hopefully help people start seeing that aspect of it. Well, I think actually you're right. I mean, the risk now, the risk isn't staying, stay in where you are. The risk is not going where you want to be because things are moving so fast right now. I mean, I'm sure you've seen ChatGPT and that shit that just launched a couple. I mean, dude, that is, that I'm here, that is fundamentally going to change everything. Like we're going to start to see technology excel at such a rapid pace right now. The fact that I can go to ChatGPT and say, hey, ChatGPT, write me some code for a software that I want to build. I want to create a CRM that includes LinkedIn and contact database and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, and integrates into this.

Write me code that does that. And me as a dumbass who knows nothing about coding can just say that to ChatGPT and it'll write a software for me. Like jobs, you think your job is safe right now? I'll give you six months until I promise your job is impacted by something like a ChatGPT. And that's just like a, like a, the version that the, you know, version three that they're out there with. I'm hearing shit about like how Google and Facebook have stuff that is light years ahead of what ChatGPT is doing right now. And so I think the, the, the risk right now is actually standing still and, and thinking that you don't need to evolve because, because you're okay with where you are right now. I, I, it's going to be scary what happens for those, those people who are feel comfortable right now.

And, and I love that you said that because that actually ties into the second piece where I think a lot of people either don't succeed or are afraid to is they don't embrace technology and social media and what the future, you know, has and what currently is. Because for me personally, like we were talking about social media, a lot of great things exist out there. Like shout out to any 11 year old that 10 years from now is probably going to have their own company without again, needing a college degree, because all that information is literally in your hand. And I have friends that are like, I hate social media. I hate seeing all this and that, and this phony lifestyle that people are living when it's like, wait a minute, there's another side to that coin where you could learn so much about how to learn a skill about yourself, something that just entertains you.

And you can really apply that and make something happen for you. And, and that to me is a big piece that I think a lot of people don't really embrace is that you're on your phone all the time. Change, change the mindset a little bit and focus on like, Hey, what, what can I learn today? What can I, what can I gather? And what can I apply to help make myself get to where I want to be? Finishing up the one topic I want to hit you on, hit on is related to that, which is it's bananas that 11 year old kid right now could start a company, could, you know, leapfrog, you know, where, where they are today and compared to where they could be tomorrow compared to historically what could have happened. Right.

What are your thoughts though, on the danger of, of skipping too many steps and, and, and missing on the fundamentals in some ways. Right. Cause one of my, one of the fears I have, and you're probably seeing it more than I do, cause you work with directly with them is you have these kids coming out of school right now. Right. And they're, they're, they're going into a virtual environment. All right. Um, I think that, I mean, the amount of learning that I had early in my career, because I was in the office, because I was at networking events, because I was just around other people, you know what I mean? And then interacting with a team, not like this, not on zoom, but in person, right. That gave me a foundation of, of understanding people, empathy, those types of things.

And I, I feel very blessed that we were one of the last generations where we were the last generation as Gen Xers to grow up without technology. Right. So, so when technology happened, I'll give you a quick example before, like in, in 98, when I came out of college, right? 99, when I come out of college networking, like email, wasn't really a thing. Cold calling was still it, but networking was where I found all my business. Right. So I'd go to business, I'd go to networking events. I'd go to networking groups and I would just grind and grind and grind and grind and grind. Right. So then when LinkedIn popped, it made sense to me. You know what I mean? I was like, Oh, here's a technology that I can apply my understanding of networking to and amplify my ability to network.

Um, so there was an appreciation because there was a foundation. I have a bit of a fear right now of this, this, this new generation coming into a remote workforce without the interaction with people and, and think in, and being in this Instagram social world where everything looks perfect and the grind is not celebrated as much on how to get there. So are you seeing similar things happening or am I just being one of those old dudes? It's like back in my day, you know, you should have fucking made, you know, 50 dials a day and rah, rah, rah. Like, where are you on that one? Yeah. It's funny. You say that in the DJing world, they call it old heads and all heads are always talking about like, it was way harder back then for me and y'all get the luxury of doing technology now.

And here's where my thoughts on everything is, is that I agree. Technology can take us to places we had never managed before. But like you said about that journey, if it happens so fast that you don't really embrace the process when it really comes down to it, when it comes to a lot of these, you know, more difficult, challenging situations that really test you, you're not going to know what to do. An example of this, right? And I'll use two, both DJing and a professional one. A lot of these DJs, they get popular on Instagram. They just buy a controller. They don't use, you know, the old, the old head stuff, but you're not using turntables and vinyl. They learn to DJ, they get really big and everyone on social media loves them.

And they're like, come to my club. When they get to the club, I don't know how to read the crowd. The music doesn't, it doesn't hit well. I don't know how to adjust to it. And they learn the hard way, right? And that's a little bit of just, you know, not really taking the time to do your research, be intentional, you know, figure things out rather than like, I'm taking this W and running with it. Same thing with SDRs and sales, right? You can, you can come in and you can possibly be the best interviewer possible or hear that being an SDR is this luxurious thing where you're going to become an AE and make a ton of money. And you come in with that, right? And, you know, when you try to take shortcuts such as like, Hey, I'm not going to cold call.

I'm just going to send out a whole bunch of messages and hopefully land my meetings. What do you think happens when you become an AE and you handle an objection? It's not something where you're not going to be equipped to think on your toes, handle it live and be successful. And a lot of these, you know, my, my notion when it comes to promotions has always been, I don't care what your number that you hit and how long you have or the short time you've been here. Like if you can crush your quota and you can show the competencies and understanding of being a strong salesperson, I'll do it. But if you've been putting autopilot messaging on for 24 months and overachieving quota, but I know when it comes down to talking to a prospect live and negotiating that that's not going to happen, you're not going to be successful.

The company's not be successful. No one wins. So I think going back to your point, taking the time to just really embrace this process and be intentional, do your research. And a lot of that comes with passion that ties it all together. When you do that, you avoid the high rise and not being, not knowing what to do versus, okay, I don't need to get ready. I'm ready right now because I took all this time to really learn and understand my craft. Yeah. And I think there's a, there's that threshold of, of knowledge that a lot of the old guard is, is annoyed with right now. So I've always liked being a Gen Xer because I'm kind of the bridge between the old and the new, right? In a lot of ways. And it's funny.

And it's funny. I see people out there being like, Oh, I'm working on my craft. And they're a sales influencer who's working on their craft, but their craft is how to create a better post. The craft is how to, how to look better on camera. So you can, you know what I mean? It's not actually selling because if you listen to what they're spewing, it's like, uh, and you look at their background, for instance, you're like, wait a minute, you've been a sales rep for a hot minute here. You were a manager for fucking six months and now you're a guru who's sitting there telling me what to do with my life. And when you say you're working on your craft, you're, you're working on being an influencer and I'm sorry, that's not a craft, right?

You are an influencer because of your craft. You are not an, like a craft. Like I went to the, the front, the, so I went to a Bruins game at Fenway. It was a, the winter classic. And it was the, it was the most pathetic thing I had ever heard. They were like, Oh, we have our hockey influencers out here. So everybody, and they kept calling them influencers, like, Hey, hockey influencer. And I mean, you should have seen the, going back to Boston, like in the crowd, like everybody in the crowd is like a fucking hockey influencer. Like, like these people lost all credibility with the real hockey players. Right. But if you took that word influencer out of them and you actually watched how they were on the, on the ice, like these were baller hockey players, you know what I mean?

Like they, they, but it's because they were influencers. So I think there's this perception that you can be an influencer. It's like every kid who wants to be a motivational speaker at 20 years old. It's like, what in the fuck have you done in your life that allows you to be a motivational speaker at 20 years old? You haven't even lived yet. You know what I mean? So that's kind of part of it. It's like, like, I hope that there's not a misperception of what working on your craft really is. And I fear that there is. At a thousand percent in, you know, for, for anyone that's listening to this, especially too, because, you know, going, going back to what we're talking about and just, you know, trying to figure out what it is that you want to do and get ready.

Like there's so much that comes and benefits from, again, just doing your research, being really intentional with what is that your goal is and what you want to do. That comes in a magnitude of what's going to benefit you down the road. You know, if, if you know already that this is a company you want to work for, don't let anything stop you from getting to that point. I think some of the most successful candidates that I've been reached out to during this time, not only reached out to me with a very, you know, thoughtful message, they're like, Oh, by the way, I talked to one of your, your sales reps for a good 30 minutes. I have a great understanding of the culture and I know this is the company I want to be with.

Talk to me, let's set time. How can I get on your calendar and intention, intention, intention. That's just the key word there. And when you make those strides to do that, dividends get paid from that. Love it. I think that's a good spot to end, even though I think we could keep going here. So Anthony, look, I love the conversation here. What's any parting thoughts and then tell people, you know, where they can learn more about what you're doing and, and, you know, obviously if you've got any job openings or anything like that, uh, let people know where they can get in touch with you. Yeah, for sure. So just a part of a last minute advice. Some people are listening, but I'm just going to look in the camera here.

You're going to be fine. Everything at this time may seem like it's not the best day in the world, but here's some tips that I think that you can do to really stand out to make sure you're successful reaching out to any hiring manager or any company you want to work for. Do your research on the culture and talk to a lot of people in that role that you're doing to learn a little bit more if this is a good fit for you or not. And also some tips on how you can prepare and be successful. Make sure that you're reaching out to the hiring manager with a very personalized message. Technology nowadays is getting smart. And I can tell when I get the same message from 20 different people in my inbox that this isn't, this isn't creative.

This is just you plugging me into a sequence. So stand out, make sure you're sending personalized messaging and most importantly, figure out the company you want to do and come into that interview ready to ask those tough questions. Make sure you ask, what's your thoughts on, you know, people? How have you worked with a company or a person that just didn't do well before? What's your thoughts on that? Interview them. And then hopefully when you do find that company that you do find after doing all those steps, you'll be happy, you'll be healthy, and won't have to find yourself in this situation. Where a lot of people can find me, I am on LinkedIn, Anthony Nava, N-A-V as in Victor A. Not hiring right now, but I always believe in speaking with people and figuring out when that time does come, I would love to reach out to you.

So any salespeople that are looking for a role or just want to speak and talk shop about what it's like to be successful or what to do during this time, I've read emails. I've given feedback on interviews. I'm happy to do that for anyone. And lastly, if you want to catch me on social, Anthony Midas, M-I-D-A-S, on all socials. Love to see you all there and connect with you on that as well. Killer, is that your DJ handle too? That is my DJ, the Midas touch, baby. I didn't even ask what kind of music. Like DM or what? Hip-hop is like my first true love. So I'll play the new stuff, the throwbacks, the hits. But, you know, once in a while, I love to get me into a little rave and throw a little some electronic music in there.

Yeah, I'm a 90s hip-hop boy myself. So like I firmly believe that hip-hop died with Tupac and Biggie. But I love it. But the EDM stuff, I actually, I was like a ripped jeans, beer drinking Budweiser kid. And then I went to a club one day and, you know, had some other influences, if you will. And my eyes got wide the fuck open to EDM. And so I'm all in on those festivals and shit. So maybe I'll see you out there. Yeah, hey, man, if I ever have a show in Boston, you know, you're the first person I'm hitting up. Gotta hit me up. Yeah, we have a Halloween party every year where I get a couple of DJs from Winter Music Festival come up to the house and tear it up. And we got a live saxophone dude who comes, plays live sax with EDM DJs.

And we get about, you know, 50, 60 of our friends at our house every year. And it's a baller every single time. So I gotta keep having fun, man. You love it, man. All right, brother. Well, thank you very much for coming on board here, Anthony. I really appreciate it. Appreciate you too, John. Thanks. And everybody out there listening, hopefully you enjoyed the conversation as much as I did and picked up a few nuggets here or there to help you maybe gain a different perspective and realize that it is going to be okay as long as you keep moving forward here. So like I always say at the end of all my podcasts here, look, go out there and make somebody smile today. Because no matter how bad your day went or how bad you think it's going, you make somebody smile today, you know you had a good day and the world needs a lot more of that right now.

So thank you all very much and I'll see you on the other side. Thank you so much for your time today and listening to the podcast. I hope you enjoyed the conversation as much as I did. With your support and our incredible guests, we're one of the top sales podcasts in the industry with over a million downloads and I can't thank you enough. To keep the momentum going, if you could go to your favorite podcast platform and leave us a five-star review, I would greatly appreciate it. In return, I will answer any question that you have on Instagram. Hit me up there at John M as in Michael Barrows with a video question or a DM and I will get right back to you, I promise. And last but not least, if you're looking for training, I'm adjusting my training approach this year and I'm actually going to be delivering training to the masses.

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